{"id":18770,"date":"2024-04-09T07:00:45","date_gmt":"2024-04-09T11:00:45","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/www.cemeterydance.com\/extras\/?p=18770"},"modified":"2024-04-07T19:14:31","modified_gmt":"2024-04-07T23:14:31","slug":"interview-stephen-graham-jones-2","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.cemeterydance.com\/extras\/interview-stephen-graham-jones-2\/","title":{"rendered":"The Cemetery Dance Interview: Stephen Graham Jones"},"content":{"rendered":"

\"banner<\/p>\n

When we opened the first pages of Stephen Graham Jones\u2019 <\/span>My Heart Is a Chainsaw<\/span><\/i> back in 2021, we fell in love with Jade Daniels, Graham\u2019s perfect vision of teenage imperfection. She was scrappy and self-deprecating yet willfully too smart for her own good; her encyclopedic brain for horror trivia featured an artist\u2019s instinct to hyper-relate the genre to the world at large. But growing up in a small doomtown like Proofrock, Idaho, is <\/span>not<\/span><\/i> a <\/span>large world. Rather, it\u2019s a suffocating microcosm of our crumbling society where the walls are closing in, largely to the fault of her own imagination and the occult boundaries her mind crosses to materialize various personifications of said doom.<\/span><\/p>\n

\"\"
Stephen Graham Jones
(Photo by Gary Isaacs)<\/figcaption><\/figure>\n

Then through 2022\u2019s <\/span>Don\u2019t Fear the Reaper<\/span><\/i>, we grew up with Jade, only to realize the more things change, the more they stay the same, even while the body count of Proofrock\u2019s finite population rose with the tide of that cursed lake. All the while there\u2019s a serial killer named Dark Mill South who seemed only a red herring, where even after his capture, he kept escaping; all the while paling in comparison to something untouchable under the surface of everything.<\/span><\/p>\n

And when we commit to surviving something like Graham\u2019s brilliant trilogy, even in the beginning, you\u2019re already dreading the ending. And because of the inherent gravity of heartbreak, we knew there would have to be a finale for the finest final girl, Jade Daniels. In <\/span>The Angel of Indian Lake<\/span><\/i>, the third and last installment of the Indian Lake Trilogy, Graham successfully ties up every loose end, like serpents slithering down our neck, shedding from multiple real time eternities from the condensed Savage History of Proofrock.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

And now it\u2019s all history, just like that?<\/span><\/p>\n

I had to ask the man.<\/span><\/p>\n

(Interview conducted by\u00a0Gabriel Hart<\/a>)<\/strong><\/p>\n

CEMETERY DANCE: You\u2019ve spent so much time with Jade Daniels throughout these three large books. It\u2019s one thing for the reader to say goodbye, but how does it feel for you to have to say goodbye to a character so immersive? You recently mentioned how great it was to have \u201cworked\u201d with Jade, as if she was an actress and you the director, yet you\u2019ve also had to <\/b>become<\/i><\/b> her in this trilogy.\u00a0 Is there a wistfulness from you towards her final exit, like a part of you has died?<\/b><\/p>\n

STEPHEN GRAHAM JONES: Yeah, I\u2019ve seen Jade at five years old, hugging her mom\u2019s leg, and I\u2019ve seen her smoking a thousand cigarettes on the bench by the lake. I\u2019ve seen her slathered in blood, chest rising and falling, eyes and teeth flashing white, and I\u2019ve seen her stumbling through the dark and cold, cutting her own leg to try to let the pain out, or give it a reason, anyway. I\u2019m not sure I\u2019ve ever known a character of mine this well. It\u2019s what happens when you spend 1,500 pages with them, maybe? I miss her in a physical way, yeah. A way that hurts.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

It\u2019s often said that our worldview affects our destiny, yet Jade’s nerve endings seem fused to the lives blood and infrastructure of Proofrock; her hellbent cynicism extraordinary enough for the 100+ body count she initially prayed for, before spending the rest her life trying to stop more bloodshed and escape the burden of psychic responsibility. Could Proofrock be as cursed as it is without Jade Daniels, or is it so cursed it would have created her no matter what?<\/b><\/p>\n

I think the events of <\/span>Chainsaw<\/span><\/i> happen with or without Jade, yeah. She hoped and prayed for a slasher to come, sure, but she didn\u2019t actually make what happened happen. In <\/span>Reaper<\/span><\/i>, though, it was all kind of \u201cmeant\u201d for her, so . . . she\u2019s not responsible, someone else is. But her coming home is the trigger that starts it all. Then, in <\/span>The Angel of Indian Lake — <\/span><\/i>I best not say, right? Don\u2019t want to spoil anyone\u2019s read. But, yes, Proofrock is in some sense cursed. How I see Jade in all of that is . . . she\u2019s the counterweight, the antidote, the one \u201cnature\u201d or \u201cfairness\u201d or whatever you want to call it kicks up to resist the bad happening. In slashers, it\u2019s always the killer who shows up first, and only then does that killer\u2019s opposite, the final girl, rise to stand against that killer. That\u2019s what Jade is, to me: the one who pushes back, the one who doesn\u2019t know how to give up. The one willing to trade parts of herself, even all of herself, to protect the ones she loves — that she\u2019s surprised she loves, I think.<\/span><\/p>\n

The Indian Lake Trilogy<\/b> is largely constructed of cycles. There\u2019s the most obvious slasher-cycle, but also the cycles of trauma and the cycles of revenge, both of which can be insidious and repellent bedfellows. Some of these characters end up with further trauma due to indulging their wrath. Was Jade just another statistic of this spinning wheel, or what wisdom was she trying to impart to us?<\/b><\/p>\n

Violence begets violence, definitely, and bloodfeuds only fuel more bloodfeuding. Jade doesn\u2019t start these cycles — cyclones, really — but she is pulled into them time and again. And then she has to carve her way out, pulling along whoever she can find in the darkness. If Jade\u2019s trying to impart anything to us, by example, I think it\u2019s that these stories, this genre, it isn\u2019t about a lone champion, a sole fighter, a single survivor. Standing alone at the top of a mountain of dead, having won the day . . . what does that matter, if you don\u2019t have anyone? For me, over the course of these three books, Jade has taught us how to push back against the bad, yes. But she\u2019s also, hopefully, taught us to hold onto those who are important to us. To make your own family, and then fight tooth and nail for them.<\/span><\/p>\n

You\u2019ve just completed the <\/b>Indian Lake Trilogy<\/b>, which could be considered an epic 1,300-page work. We\u2019d think you\u2019d have taken a breath, but you\u2019re about to release <\/b>I Was a Teenage Slasher <\/i><\/b>this spring, and soon enough you\u2019ll be releasing two more novels <\/b>The Buffalo Hunter Hunter<\/i><\/b> and <\/b>Last Stand at Saber Ridge<\/i><\/b>. You also teach, which is consuming in itself. How do you find the time to write so prolifically?<\/b><\/p>\n

\"coverWish I could say it was that I just type fast, but . . . I think it\u2019s two things, really. Okay, three, the first of them being simply luck: I\u2019ve lucked into a life that leaves me an extra twenty minutes here and there, which I can fill with words. Second, I try to always choose writing above everything but health and family. I used to have a third thing there, but I\u2019ve forgotten what it was. But, without health, you can\u2019t get to the keyboard <\/span>to<\/span><\/i> write, and if you don\u2019t always put family first, as a certain Mr. Toretto would say, then . . . then you don\u2019t have all the kinds of support you need just to be and stay human. <\/span><\/p>\n

Years back, when I was first starting writing, I asked Janet Burroway for her best advice, embarking on a life-long thing like writing fiction. Her answer is one I\u2019ve lived by, and am so thankful for: always leave the door of your study open, so your people can come in. Who cares if they interrupt a sentence, a scene. Sentences and scenes are great, but they\u2019re not as great as seeing your kids grow up. Nothing compares to that. Finally, third, the way I kick a lot of pages out is that writing is recess, to me. I get to sit here at this keyboard and play with dragons, right? Why wouldn\u2019t I want to do that every single chance I get? Too, these stories, they\u2019re finally the only place I can make things make sense. The world, to me, is impossible to comprehend. I can\u2019t figure out why things happen as they do. There\u2019s kids going to bed hungry, I mean. Teachers aren\u2019t paid enough. We seem to be willfully destroying the environment. None of this tracks, to me, and a lot of it hurts. But, when I\u2019m here on the page — when I\u2019m here, I can make the bad things that happen make sense, at least for a little bit. If I believe hard enough in the reality under my fingertips, then I can sort of get a sense that things might work out. And, yeah, saying it like this, I can see that I\u2019m sort hiding in made-up worlds. Guilty as charged, twice over. But, I learned that at the figurative feet of Robert E. Howard, who would so rather be in Hyperborea than Cross Plains, Texas. So, at least I\u2019m not the only one?<\/span><\/p>\n

The Indian Lake Trilogy was heavily steeped in horror trivia, the way Jade\u2019s mind would relate everything she encountered to a classic or obscure horror film. Your fandom for the genre was obviously a huge influence on this trilogy, but what kind of influences do you have outside of horror? I\u2019ve always sensed a Pynchon-esque quality of your work, the way it challenges the reader\u2019s sensibilities, almost psychedelic in the blurring of POVs and voice.\u00a0\u00a0<\/b><\/p>\n

Oh, wow, my skull must be made of glass — you\u2019re seeing right to the core of me. For years in my twenties, I was on every Pynchon discussion board, and I was driving eight or ten hours to pawn shops and the like, to lay down grocery money for an issue of this or that magazine that Pynchon was supposed to have written something in, maybe under his own name, maybe not. There\u2019s that bit in <\/span>Gravity\u2019s Rainbow<\/span><\/i> where Tyrone Slothrop goes on his big, not-very-willing journey through the toilets? I feel like that\u2019s me — that I leaned over too far into Pynchon\u2019s pages and got sucked in, am still cycling through the plumbing. For my money, the ending of <\/span>The Crying of Lot 49<\/span><\/i> is one of the best endings a book\u2019s ever pulled off. My first novel, even, <\/span>The Fast Red Road<\/span><\/i>, that\u2019s me at my most naked, trying to write my own <\/span>V<\/span><\/i>. Years back, I got <\/span>Demon Theory<\/span><\/i> onto His desk, even. Since then, I\u2019ve spoken with someone who actually had dinner with Him. All of which is to say, yeah, I still worship at this particular altar. Maybe it\u2019s why my knees hurt so much, these days. But it\u2019s also why my eyes are so wide open.<\/span><\/p>\n

It\u2019s reassuring that your style is so challenging yet well-received; it says a lot for the typical assumption that American readers have been dumbed down. I recently read that <\/b>I Was a Teenage Slasher<\/i><\/b> will be your most accessible book to date. Was this a conscious effort? How does the voice or style differ from the <\/b>Indian Lake Trilogy<\/i><\/b>?\u00a0<\/b><\/p>\n

\"coverYeah, <\/span>I Was a Teenage Slasher<\/span><\/i> is more accessible than the <\/span>Indian Lake<\/span><\/i> trilogy. Wish I could say that was strategic or intentional. Really, it\u2019s just that the narrator for <\/span>Teen Slasher<\/span><\/i>, this guy Tolly Driver, he\u2019s not Jade. Jade\u2019s thinking, listening to her, man, it\u2019s like drinking from a firehose, right? She\u2019s always on her back foot, fighting this or that. That\u2019s not how it is for Tolly. Tolly\u2019s narration, it comes from a different place. Maybe just because he\u2019s in West Texas, where you never say anything direct. In West Texas, you\u2019re always coming in way around the side — if you say something direct, like you actually mean it, then you\u2019re likely to get punched, stabbed, shot, or catch a tire iron to the back of the head later that night. So, being indirect, it\u2019s a survival thing. Another way to say all this is that <\/span>Teen Slasher<\/span><\/i> is the most <\/span>Mongrels<\/span><\/i> book I\u2019ve done since, well, <\/span>Mongrels<\/span><\/i>. But, as for anything intentional, I did, in <\/span>Teen Slasher<\/span><\/i>, make the rule for myself that I couldn\u2019t drop the title of a single slasher or slasher film. I wanted <\/span>Teen Slasher<\/span><\/i> to pivot not on trivia, like I\u2019ve done in <\/span>Demon Theory<\/span><\/i>, <\/span>The Last Final Girl<\/span><\/i>, and the <\/span>Indian Lake<\/span><\/i> trilogy, but . . . something different. I had a sort of sense that, if I tried really hard, and got really lucky, I could find a different pivot point, I could find the handle on a different hatch, and creak it open, look at the slasher a new way. <\/span><\/p>\n

Teen Slasher<\/span><\/i> is a book where I feel like I got really lucky. But, any of my books that maybe halfway work, that\u2019s always why: luck. Wish I could claim skill or technique, craft or experience, but . . . it\u2019s always just luck. It\u2019s me dropping a lot of pieces on the floor, and they sort of fall into a pattern that\u2019s really a picture. I can\u2019t always get that lucky. But sometimes I do.<\/span><\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

When we opened the first pages of Stephen Graham Jones\u2019 My Heart Is a Chainsaw back in 2021, we fell in love with Jade Daniels, Graham\u2019s perfect vision of teenage imperfection. She was scrappy and self-deprecating yet willfully too smart for her own good; her encyclopedic brain for horror trivia featured an artist\u2019s instinct to … Continue Reading! “The Cemetery Dance Interview: Stephen Graham Jones”<\/span><\/a><\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":5,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"jetpack_post_was_ever_published":false,"_jetpack_newsletter_access":"","_jetpack_dont_email_post_to_subs":false,"_jetpack_newsletter_tier_id":0,"_jetpack_memberships_contains_paywalled_content":false,"_jetpack_memberships_contains_paid_content":false,"footnotes":"","jetpack_publicize_message":"","jetpack_publicize_feature_enabled":true,"jetpack_social_post_already_shared":true,"jetpack_social_options":{"image_generator_settings":{"template":"highway","default_image_id":0,"font":"","enabled":false},"version":2}},"categories":[7],"tags":[3144,2899,307,692],"class_list":["post-18770","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-interviews","tag-angel-of-indian-lake","tag-gabriel-hart","tag-interviews","tag-stephen-graham-jones"],"yoast_head":"\nThe Cemetery Dance Interview: Stephen Graham Jones - 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